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	<title>Comments on: Dear Tom Friedman: Don’t Want You to Die Off &#8230; Just Get Well!</title>
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	<link>http://www.masterresource.org/2009/11/tom-we-dont-want-you-to-die-we-just-want-you-to-get-well/</link>
	<description>A free-market energy blog</description>
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		<title>By: Jon Boone</title>
		<link>http://www.masterresource.org/2009/11/tom-we-dont-want-you-to-die-we-just-want-you-to-get-well/comment-page-1/#comment-3492</link>
		<dc:creator>Jon Boone</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 02 Dec 2009 21:32:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.masterresource.org/?p=5848#comment-3492</guid>
		<description>Rod:
If the strategy is a realistic decrease of  CO2 emissions as the result of human activity over the next twenty years, then nuclear is the main tactic to be deployed. Doubling nuclear capacity for electricity baseload would reduce the need for coal capacity rather substantially. 

In this way, battery-operated vehicles could plug into &quot;cleaner,&quot; even &quot;greener&quot; grid, thereby reducing greenhouse gas emissions somewhat in the transportation sector. And if the percentage of electricity use for heating continues to climb--as it has rather drastically for the last 20 years, even more carbon emissions reductions could be achieved.

But, as you suggest, it all must start with a concerted promotion of the nuclear industry, although clearly you have a dog in this fight.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Rod:<br />
If the strategy is a realistic decrease of  CO2 emissions as the result of human activity over the next twenty years, then nuclear is the main tactic to be deployed. Doubling nuclear capacity for electricity baseload would reduce the need for coal capacity rather substantially. </p>
<p>In this way, battery-operated vehicles could plug into &#8220;cleaner,&#8221; even &#8220;greener&#8221; grid, thereby reducing greenhouse gas emissions somewhat in the transportation sector. And if the percentage of electricity use for heating continues to climb&#8211;as it has rather drastically for the last 20 years, even more carbon emissions reductions could be achieved.</p>
<p>But, as you suggest, it all must start with a concerted promotion of the nuclear industry, although clearly you have a dog in this fight.</p>
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		<title>By: Rod Adams</title>
		<link>http://www.masterresource.org/2009/11/tom-we-dont-want-you-to-die-we-just-want-you-to-get-well/comment-page-1/#comment-3424</link>
		<dc:creator>Rod Adams</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 29 Nov 2009 11:33:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.masterresource.org/?p=5848#comment-3424</guid>
		<description>As a proponent of nuclear energy, I am sometimes amused by the way that gas and oil supporters point to the energy density of their fuel. I once served on a submarine whose fuel source was installed in 1981. That 9,000 ton submarine then operated until 1995 without ever getting any new fuel.

The total active component mass in that fuel source weighed just a bit more than what I do and the entire assembly could comfortably fit under my office desk, not including necessary shielding. Even with shielding it could fit inside my spare bedroom office, a room that is not large enough for a queen sized bed and furniture.

I am also amused by the amount of money that the natural gas industry is currently spending on marketing to convince people that a 100 year supply - at current consumption rates - is something to get excited about.

I have a great deal of optimism about the Earth&#039;s ability to support its current and projected human population in abundance, but only because I understand just how much uranium and thorium there is in the accessible portions of the Earth&#039;s crust. Thousands of years of all of the energy that 10 billion people need is far more impressive to me than 100 years of less than 20% of the current US energy consumption.

Rod Adams
Publisher, Atomic Insights</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>As a proponent of nuclear energy, I am sometimes amused by the way that gas and oil supporters point to the energy density of their fuel. I once served on a submarine whose fuel source was installed in 1981. That 9,000 ton submarine then operated until 1995 without ever getting any new fuel.</p>
<p>The total active component mass in that fuel source weighed just a bit more than what I do and the entire assembly could comfortably fit under my office desk, not including necessary shielding. Even with shielding it could fit inside my spare bedroom office, a room that is not large enough for a queen sized bed and furniture.</p>
<p>I am also amused by the amount of money that the natural gas industry is currently spending on marketing to convince people that a 100 year supply &#8211; at current consumption rates &#8211; is something to get excited about.</p>
<p>I have a great deal of optimism about the Earth&#8217;s ability to support its current and projected human population in abundance, but only because I understand just how much uranium and thorium there is in the accessible portions of the Earth&#8217;s crust. Thousands of years of all of the energy that 10 billion people need is far more impressive to me than 100 years of less than 20% of the current US energy consumption.</p>
<p>Rod Adams<br />
Publisher, Atomic Insights</p>
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		<title>By: Jon Boone</title>
		<link>http://www.masterresource.org/2009/11/tom-we-dont-want-you-to-die-we-just-want-you-to-get-well/comment-page-1/#comment-3393</link>
		<dc:creator>Jon Boone</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 25 Nov 2009 02:34:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.masterresource.org/?p=5848#comment-3393</guid>
		<description>You&#039;re welcome, Donald. 

Cap and trade has worked to limit clearly measurable levels of sulfur dioxide, nitrous oxide, and mercury in coal plants because (a) those chemicals are relatively easy to quantify and (b) they can be reasonably inexpensively mitigated. The problem with CO2 is its ubiquity. It is therefore difficult to quantify and virtually impossible to truthfully avoid, given the limited means of accomplishing this. 

If nuclear capacity does not increase and hydro remains limited (each year the percentage of its use gets smaller), what else do we have except fossil fuels to produce electricity reliably and affordably? Certainly not wind and solar. Nor is carbon &quot;sequestration&quot; likely to work, although I&#039;m sure billions will be squandered down this rathole. 

Consequently, cap and trade will devolve into a shell game in the United States, as it has in Europe, where the same people responsible for the C&amp;T system would do the &quot;accounting.&quot; As a number of &quot;financial investment&quot; firms over the last decade have shown, one can do virtually anything with numbers if one can control the accounting method. Eventually, however, the truth about the fudged books will out.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You&#8217;re welcome, Donald. </p>
<p>Cap and trade has worked to limit clearly measurable levels of sulfur dioxide, nitrous oxide, and mercury in coal plants because (a) those chemicals are relatively easy to quantify and (b) they can be reasonably inexpensively mitigated. The problem with CO2 is its ubiquity. It is therefore difficult to quantify and virtually impossible to truthfully avoid, given the limited means of accomplishing this. </p>
<p>If nuclear capacity does not increase and hydro remains limited (each year the percentage of its use gets smaller), what else do we have except fossil fuels to produce electricity reliably and affordably? Certainly not wind and solar. Nor is carbon &#8220;sequestration&#8221; likely to work, although I&#8217;m sure billions will be squandered down this rathole. </p>
<p>Consequently, cap and trade will devolve into a shell game in the United States, as it has in Europe, where the same people responsible for the C&amp;T system would do the &#8220;accounting.&#8221; As a number of &#8220;financial investment&#8221; firms over the last decade have shown, one can do virtually anything with numbers if one can control the accounting method. Eventually, however, the truth about the fudged books will out.</p>
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		<title>By: Donald Hertzmark</title>
		<link>http://www.masterresource.org/2009/11/tom-we-dont-want-you-to-die-we-just-want-you-to-get-well/comment-page-1/#comment-3381</link>
		<dc:creator>Donald Hertzmark</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 23 Nov 2009 22:14:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.masterresource.org/?p=5848#comment-3381</guid>
		<description>Jon, Peter,
Thanks for your comments.  It is often said that smart people learn from the mistakes of others, and the rest of us have to make our own mistakes.  After watching the ineffective EU cap and trade program, one would have to conclude that there are better ways to reduce carbon emissions.  The analogy to the mostly successful sulphur reduction program in the US is inapt because that program involved about 600 stacks and an element (S) that was not essential to the product.  Carbon, of course, is essential to the use of hydrocarbons and the number of stacks is almost beyond imagination.

If one really thinks that carbon is a problem then it needs a price, not a son of Enron approach that will accomplish little on the main purpose while doing a great deal of damage to the economy (and landscape).</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Jon, Peter,<br />
Thanks for your comments.  It is often said that smart people learn from the mistakes of others, and the rest of us have to make our own mistakes.  After watching the ineffective EU cap and trade program, one would have to conclude that there are better ways to reduce carbon emissions.  The analogy to the mostly successful sulphur reduction program in the US is inapt because that program involved about 600 stacks and an element (S) that was not essential to the product.  Carbon, of course, is essential to the use of hydrocarbons and the number of stacks is almost beyond imagination.</p>
<p>If one really thinks that carbon is a problem then it needs a price, not a son of Enron approach that will accomplish little on the main purpose while doing a great deal of damage to the economy (and landscape).</p>
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		<title>By: peter dublin</title>
		<link>http://www.masterresource.org/2009/11/tom-we-dont-want-you-to-die-we-just-want-you-to-get-well/comment-page-1/#comment-3377</link>
		<dc:creator>peter dublin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 23 Nov 2009 17:37:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.masterresource.org/?p=5848#comment-3377</guid>
		<description>Donald,
I guess you&#039;ve heard the latest from the Senate on the Kerry-Boxer bill that some of them are coming round to looking at simplification which just sets power station emission limits etc

Cap and Trade is of course pointless , 
the &quot;No Goldilocks Solution&quot;,
as we have seen in the EU where the problem with carbon prices is they are either too low and so cheap and meaningless as  in recession times,
or  too high to lead to any reduction at other times, when evasive
action for example involves paying off third world emitters (who according to a recent Economist article can simply be set up to rake in cash ie would not be emittiong otherwise), or tree planting exercises of dubious effect, which may in any case be fast growing non-native  trees which changes local ecosystems.
An artificial market will always be an artificial market.

Emission Trading  (Cap and Trade)
http://ceolas.net/#cce5x
Basic Idea 
Offsets -- Tree Planting -- Manufacture Shift -- Fair Trade -- Surreal Market -- Allowances: Auctions + Hand-Outs -- Allowance Trading -- Companies: Business Stability + Cost
In Conclusion</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Donald,<br />
I guess you&#8217;ve heard the latest from the Senate on the Kerry-Boxer bill that some of them are coming round to looking at simplification which just sets power station emission limits etc</p>
<p>Cap and Trade is of course pointless ,<br />
the &#8220;No Goldilocks Solution&#8221;,<br />
as we have seen in the EU where the problem with carbon prices is they are either too low and so cheap and meaningless as  in recession times,<br />
or  too high to lead to any reduction at other times, when evasive<br />
action for example involves paying off third world emitters (who according to a recent Economist article can simply be set up to rake in cash ie would not be emittiong otherwise), or tree planting exercises of dubious effect, which may in any case be fast growing non-native  trees which changes local ecosystems.<br />
An artificial market will always be an artificial market.</p>
<p>Emission Trading  (Cap and Trade)<br />
<a href="http://ceolas.net/#cce5x" rel="nofollow">http://ceolas.net/#cce5x</a><br />
Basic Idea<br />
Offsets &#8212; Tree Planting &#8212; Manufacture Shift &#8212; Fair Trade &#8212; Surreal Market &#8212; Allowances: Auctions + Hand-Outs &#8212; Allowance Trading &#8212; Companies: Business Stability + Cost<br />
In Conclusion</p>
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		<title>By: Jon Boone</title>
		<link>http://www.masterresource.org/2009/11/tom-we-dont-want-you-to-die-we-just-want-you-to-get-well/comment-page-1/#comment-3364</link>
		<dc:creator>Jon Boone</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 22 Nov 2009 02:07:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.masterresource.org/?p=5848#comment-3364</guid>
		<description>Thanks for this thoughtful piece, leavened by Marlo Lewis&#039; accurate observations. Friedman&#039;s views on virtually every front, but particularly on energy and the environment, are virtually indistinguishable from fantasy, uncontaminated as they are by reality.

His arguments are bad. His persona has become grotesque; he is now a buffoonish caricature, the Foghorn Leghorn of energy punditry. &quot;I say, I say I say, boy, is that a chicken hawk I see over yonder...?&quot;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks for this thoughtful piece, leavened by Marlo Lewis&#8217; accurate observations. Friedman&#8217;s views on virtually every front, but particularly on energy and the environment, are virtually indistinguishable from fantasy, uncontaminated as they are by reality.</p>
<p>His arguments are bad. His persona has become grotesque; he is now a buffoonish caricature, the Foghorn Leghorn of energy punditry. &#8220;I say, I say I say, boy, is that a chicken hawk I see over yonder&#8230;?&#8221;</p>
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